Sportstar Podcast: Boxing at Paris Olympics – Former coach Bhaskar Bhatt analyses India’s chances

In this episode of the Sportstar Podcast, former senior women’s boxing coach Bhaskar Bhatt breaks down India’s rocky road to the 2024 Paris Olympics and what the nation’s prospects are in the Summer Games. He joins host Nihit Sachdeva, Jonathan Selvaraj and Y.B. Sarangi.

Here’s the full transcript:

Nihit: Hello and welcome to a new episode of the Sportstar Podcast. This is your host Nihit Sachdeva and joining me on this one are my senior colleagues Y.B. Sarangi, Jonathan Selvaraj and a very special guest – boxing coach Bhaskar Bhatt.

Mr. Bhatt has been a boxing coach for more than three decades. He was the assistant coach of the senior women’s team from 2005 to 2012. He then joined the youth team in 2017 before taking over as the head coach of the senior women’s team from 2021 to 2023 where he had a fantastic time. Under him, Nikhat Zareen won a gold medal at the World Championships in 2022 while Manisha Moun and Parveen Hooda won bronze medals. At the Commonwealth Games in Birmingham, Nitu Ghanghas and Nikhat clinched gold while Jaismine Lamboria bagged a bronze. To top it all, at the 2023 World Championships in New Delhi, India won four gold medals – Nikhat, Nitu, Lovlina Borgohain and Saweety Boora.Welcome to the episode, Mr. Bhatt.

Bhatt: Good evening to all of you. Thank you for inviting me to the show.

Nihit: Since it is now clear who will represent India in boxing at the Paris Olympics, we’ll discuss that. As the qualification cycle started, India clinched four quotas at the Hangzhou Asian Games itself – Nikhat, Parveen, Lovlina and Preeti Pawar. It was a great start. However, things have not been so smooth since then. Parveen lost her quota as she has been suspended for whereabouts failure. Meanwhile, the men’s team has also struggled. Do you think there was a lot of pressure as the final qualifier tournament came closer and closer?

Bhatt: Every boxer wants to see themself at the Olympics. However, the Parveen case did have an impact on the rest of the boxers because we lost a medal prospect due to misunderstanding. It is the biggest tragedy for someone who has qualified for the Olympics but is not able to go just when the event is about to take place. Jaismine filled this gap by coming down from 60kg to 57kg category but still, the entire Indian boxing family feels the pain of having to see Parveen’s Olympic dreams being shattered.

READ | India to lose Hangzhou Asian Games medal after Parveen’s suspension

Sarangi: Everyone receives the mail whenever there is a whereabouts failure – the federation, the boxer, NADA (National Anti-Doping Agency). Could this have been handled better?

Bhatt: Of course. Parveen was told to fill the form as the boxers do it with the help of our support staff. Whenever Parveen was asked, she said she had filled the form. I think there was a communication gap regarding whether it was done or not. You are right when you save everyone receives the mail but everyone has helped the boxers in filling these forms previously. Parveen said she did fill it but probably, WADA (World Anti-Doping Agency) did not receive it. For the last few months, the Boxing Federation of India and even Sports Authority of India have been trying to find out why this happened but WADA did not accept it. Therefore, our boxer had to pay the price.

Sarangi: How do we make sure that such a thing at this level does not happen again? We know some boxers probably don’t take these things seriously and consider it as a small matter but it can have big consequences.

Bhatt: As per my knowledge, this is the first such case for Indian boxing. This is a lesson. We kept telling the boxer and she herself was sure that she had filled the form. We need to be better at confirming that the form has been duly filled and submitted. Every boxer needs to take the whereabouts matter seriously so that you don’t suffer such a big loss in the future.

Jon: One month ago, Jasmine would have thought that her Paris Olympics dreams were over before she got to know that she will get another chance and she bagged the quota. Can you tell us about Jaismine’s mentality and what kind of a boxer is she?

Bhatt: Jaismine is extremely introverted. She tried twice in her weight category – 60kg – but could not find success. However, I think that as soon as she found out that she will be playing 57kg, she prepared herself in such a way that she was determined to bag the quota no matter what. She has been competing internationally for the last three-four years and has good competition experience. So, coming down from 60kg to 57kg would have given her more confidence. If you look at the three bouts from the second qualifier in Bangkok, she fought extremely well. She stayed out of her opponent’s range and managed to dominate them.

Jon: Given the kind of instant success she has got in 57kg, do you think it is a better category for Jaismine or it’s just pure luck since Parveen wasn’t available?

Bhatt: Every boxer gets an opportunity. Jaismine got that chance in this weight category and she succeeded. Considering her height, 60kg is a suitable category for her. She has even won a Commonwealth Games bronze in that class but her real achievement came at the second qualifiers in Bangkok as she fulfilled her dream of going to the Olympics.

Nihit: The first qualifier took place in Busta Arsizio, Italy from March 3-11 and it was a tough one for India as no one apart from Nishant Dev (71kg) reached the quota bouts. Nishant came close to winning the quota bout but somehow, things did not align in his favour. Since then, High-Performance Director Bernard Dunne has left his post. There were six changes made for the squad that was sent to second qualifiers. There has been a lot of controversy regarding the change in selection policy – moving away from trials to a continuous evaluation process while also reducing the number of boxers in the camp. Do you think that affected the preparation for the first qualifier?

Bhatt: Every coach has his own style of doing things. Mr. Bernard is of European mentality and his professional career has been considerably longer than amateur one. When he came here as HPD, he came with the mentality that dominates in Europe. He tried to bring that culture here amongst our boxers but the way Asian countries train is different. That’s why there was a controversy regarding selection policy. Some boxers even went to the court but since the policy was formed through a system, nothing affected it. I believe that the federation learnt a lot from this and based on the assessment of the performances at the first qualifiers, they, along with SAI, internally decided how to go about the preparation for the second qualifiers – be it the sparring partner, individual training schedule and permanent observer from BFI a NIS, Patiala. And we got the results during the second qualifiers. Every boxer fought very well. Where we were struggling to find a single win in Italy, we came very close in Bangkok even if we did not win the bout with the scores being 3-2 or 4-1. Even though we could get only three quotas, they performed much better.

ALSO READ | ‘I will not go abroad to train,’ says Amit Panghal ahead of Olympic Games

Nihit: Another interesting story that came from the second qualifiers is the comeback of Amit Panghal. When his name appeared in the squad list for Bangkok, many were surprised. When he went to the Tokyo Olympics, he was the top-ranked boxer in his division but lost his first bout. Since then, his career hasn’t been that great. He even went to court against the new selection policy. Finally, he has got the quota for Paris. Do you think all these experiences have made Amit mentally stronger?

Bhatt: I do feel that Amit has become mentally tougher due to all these experiences. He has also made changes to his game after the Tokyo Olympics. Though he could not do well in the World Championships, he performed brilliantly to win Commonwealth Games gold. Since then, he did not get many chances and there could be many reasons for this.

But after all this, Amit Panghal has raised his level to such an extent – physically and mentally – that if you look at his bouts in Bangkok, you can see how confidently he was boxing. Before leaving, he was here at the National Centre of Excellence in Rohtak for 10 days and he was confident that at present, he is the strongest boxer in his category (51kg). When a boxer has this mentality, he fights in the same way. That is how he performed in his bouts – he stayed close to his opponents and kept scoring points. At the upcoming Olympics, he is a contender for the gold medal.

Nihit: Jon, the other male Indian boxer who has qualified for Olympics is Nishant Dev. You have spoken to him before. He came close to winning the quota in Italy and he eventually clinched it in Bangkok. Do you think he is the best male boxer India has had since Tokyo?

Jon: It would be a tough call since Amit has also performed really well. Of course, Amit does not have a medal at Worlds, unlike Nishant, but he has a gold at CWG. Nishant is the most talented amongst the next generation of Indian boxers. Amit is the more experienced one. Nishant’s category – 71kg – is a heavier one and Indians generally tend to struggle in such divisions but he is a good boxer. Even the bout that he lost to USA’s Omari Jones in Italy, it looked like Nishant had sealed the win in the last round. Nishant has also defeated a Cuban boxer at World Championships, something no other Indian has done.

Nihit: Mr. Bhatt, what was your first impression of Nishant and how do you see his career graph?

Bhatt: I have been following him closely since 2022. In the last two years, I have seen Nishant improve with every competition, whether it is his game, ring craft or ring strategy. In all three departments, he has made himself stronger. He can position himself comfortably at any place inside the ring and the results show. If we talk about the heavier divisions, I feel India has produced good results in the past in these categories – Vikas Krishnan or Olympic bronze medallist Vijender Singh. Because of his reach and game sense, Nishant has a bright future. All of us expect a lot from him.

Nihit: While Amit and Nishant did grab the quotas, one male boxer who came very close but could not do it was Sachin Siwach Jr. He had two chances to win the quota in Bangkok. Mr. Sarangi, how do you analyse his performance? Where could he have done better?

Sarangi: I don’t think there was anything missing. If we see, he had to win four fights just to reach the quota bout where he lost to Filipino boxer Carlo Paalam, silver medallist from Tokyo. Then, in the box-off against Munarbek Seiitbek Uulu, he had an off-day. The way commentators were raving about Sachin’s style was good to hear. He is a decent boxer with a cool head and a steely resolve. If you speak to him, it feels like he is just a kid. He had an appendix operation due to which he missed Asian Championships last year but he was there at the Nationals. Just look at his courage. Maybe he lacks a bit of experience and 57kg is one of the toughest weight categories with the maximum number of participants.

Nihit: Even the number of quotas available were also just three. So, even after reaching the semifinals, there was no guarantee.

Sarangi: Yes. There are a lot of factors. However, he did perform well. I feel for him because he fought so well and still could not get the quota.

Nihit: Finally, if we look at the squad from Tokyo, we had nine boxers. This time, we have a team of six for Paris – two male and four female boxers. Less number, so maybe lesser chances of winning medals. Mr. Bhatt, how do you see this squad, quality wise, and what are their chances of winning medals at the Paris Olympics when compared to the squad from Tokyo?

Bhatt: I think this squad has the quality that Tokyo squad had. If you look at the track records of every boxer, they have done well in their respective categories. Even though we had five male boxers last time and this time there are only two, these two are medal prospects. I feel Sachin has been unlucky because technically as well as in ring craft, he is very clever. He played a lot of bouts and could not do well in the quota bouts. He is a very good scoring boxer but could not execute his original game. He does not stop but if you look at his final bout, he could not score much. He is undoubtedly the most talented and technical boxer.

When it comes to women, we had four boxers in Tokyo and four are there for Paris also. All of them are strong and medal contenders. Last time, we had one medal and this time, I believe we are contenders for two to three gold medals. A lot depends on how the boxers perform on the day of the bout but we have the calibre to achieve this target of two to three gold medals.

Jon: On one hand, our men’s boxing team for Tokyo looked very strong. Amit Panghal had won a silver medal at the World Championships prior to that. Compared to that, it has been a struggle to even get the qualification done. So, the men’s team is not that stronger when compared to Tokyo.

On the other hand, a lot of credit goes to Mr. Bhatt for the women’s team that has multiple World Chmapionship gold medallists – Nikhat, Lovlina. Nikhat, in fact, is a two-time world champion. Going into an Olympics, that is a bit unprecedented. Even when Mary Kom went into the London Olympics, it had been a while since she had won her last world title.

Compared to Tokyo, even though we have less qualifiers, the chances of winning medals are higher.

Sarangi: I agree. Last time too, we had good boxers such as Ashish Kumar and Pooja Rani. Even though we have lost three slots, the quality is solid. We had to wait till the last minute to ensure qualification but as Jon said, it is unprecedented that our squad has two world champions.

Another thing is that for the first time, the women’s team is bigger than the men’s team which is also unprecedented. Also, it is not necessary that the more entries you have, the more chances of winning medals. You do tend to think like that, psychologically, but Olympics are totally different. So, you need to have quality and that is solid this time. It is quite possible that we may win two medals.

Nihit: What should be the roadmap for these six boxers while they prepare for Paris?

Bhatt: BFI and SAI have already made plans for this. They had a break after coming back from Bangkok but the camp is about to begin at NIS, Patiala. Preeti, Lovlina and Nikhat have already been training there along with the focus on recovery. They will reach Paris 10-15 days before the Olympics where they will have a training camp organised by IOA. The team psychologist is in touch with the boxers.

Nihit: I would like to conclude this episode by addressing one of the biggest talking points which is the future of Boxing at the Olympics. Either there is controversy regarding the judges or the clash between International Olympic Committee and IBA, the former global governing body of the sport. There is an attempt to establish a new global body in the form of World Boxing and India has joined that recently. Do you feel the upcoming boxers might have a bit more pressure since the future of the sport is looking uncertain?

EXPLAINED | Why did India break away from International Boxing Association and join World Boxing?

Bhatt: I don’t think all this will have a lot of impact on our boxers because whether it is World Boxing or IBA, boxing will continue to exist. Some aspects are controversial which IBA is trying to solve and at the same time, a new body has been launched which we have joined. So, I don’t feel boxing will be discarded from the Olympics. For now, it is just a possibility, the IOC has asked for some clarification but with the new body, those issues should be solved soon. So, the rest of our boxers are preparing keeping in mind the dreams of winning medals at the Los Angeles Olympics in 2028.

Nihit: Jon, you had written a piece in which you explained what India joining World Boxing means. Can you reshare that for our listeners?

Jon: Right now, IOC is handling everything related to boxing for Paris – the qualifiers, the officials, etc. but they have refused to do the same for 2028. So, the sport will be there in LA only if there is a global body to handle it. Now, IBA, the former global body, has been derecognised by the IOC. I am not going into the politics behind it because that is a separate discussion altogether. The new global federation will have to start the work when the next Olympic cycle starts which means this is the last year to make that happen. Otherwise, boxing’s future at the Olympics is going to be uncertain. India joining World Boxing is significant because till now, the other members were all Western countries – USA, Canada, England – who, traditionally, have a problem with IBA. India is the first major Asian country to join World Boxing. If we see, World Boxing still has only 30 members while IBA has some 130 members. So, World Boxing will have to work hard to get more members.

India organised the last women’s world championships with IBA in New Delhi. India realised that if they want boxing to stay in the Olympics, they have to join World Boxing. There is no other option. So, they also expect other countries to join World Boxing but if they have to do it, they only have this year.

Nihit: Mr. Sarangi, if you look at IBA, they are still very adamant. They have even offered prize money to Olympic medallists. The prize pool at their events is significant and naturally, attracts a lot of boxers. So, do you feel it is going to be an easy task to replace such a body?

Sarangi: IBA will not cease to exist so easily. You have to look at how old and deep-rooted the organisation is. They have a full-fledged system. You cannot end that overnight.

While India has joined World Boxing, it has still not left IBA because the country needs IBA’s support. IBA is the one which conducts all the age-group world championships which is important for our budding boxers. If you close one door and enter another house, which is not fully constructed yet, your future generation will be ruined. They are maintaining a balance at the moment.

While IBA has been kicked out of the Olympics, it is not going to be finished so soon. World Boxing, which aspires to handle the sport globally, currently has 30 members and it needs at least 20 more to stake a claim and get the recognition from IOC to run the sport. All they have is six months in which they have to bring those 20 members.

As far as the IOC is concerned, in their latest press conference, they have unwittingly let their intentions out since they too don’t want to lose such a popular sport. They have said that the federations who continue to be associated with IBA will not be allowed to compete at LA 2028.

The deadline for World Boxing is January 25 2025. Only then we’ll get to know whether boxing stays in the Olympics or not.